home
***
CD-ROM
|
disk
|
FTP
|
other
***
search
/
AOL File Library: 4,101 to 4,200
/
aol-file-protocol-4400-4101-to-4200.zip
/
AOLDLs
/
MOS - Conference Transcripts
/
MOS Chat for 05_12_94
/
Chat Log for 051294.sit
/
Chat Log for 05_12_94
Wrap
Internet Message Format
|
1994-05-16
|
20KB
Date: 5/12/94
Start Time: 18:01:42
End Time: 23:03:48
Lines: 705
Chat length: 41832 bytes
Number of participants: 36
Participants: AFA Pieter, AFC Donna, AFC Laph, AFL Bear, AFL GeneS, AFT Ilene, Alexis Kai, AndrewWelc, AshleyM694, Austin777, BartB, BosLaw, ChuckS26, Cynic, CZygmont, DangrMous, DJM mass, EarlChr, GreyWizard, Imagewerks, Kassman, Khag, KTF Karl, LONDON1813, Macdanife, MIKEL617, MrMidi, NathanM262, Netglue, Reinfeld 1, RocknRic, Shadow Gem, Silvertone, VIOC, Y Ddraig
Alexis Kai : How 'bout that Software Update I'm hearing about?
AFL Bear : Next week, I hope. Apple Software Licensing says
they have a new procedure afoot... and with that
it might be next week, or shortly after. I guess
that's what new procedures are for. To slow
things down.
Alexis Kai : Any clues about what's gonna be in it?
AFL Bear : Um, lotsa stuff... Lessee.... Hold on a second
while I pull up the read me file that came with
SU 3.0. System Update 3.0 is a set of software
enhancements that improves the... performance
and reliability of Macintosh computers running
system software version 7.1, 7.1.1 (System 7
Pro), or 7.1.2 (for Power Macintosh). System
Update 3.0 provides all of the enhancements of
System Update 2.0.1, Hardware System Update 2.0,
and Hardware System Update 1.0, plus additional
enhancements. (For a review of the System Update
2.0.1, Hardware System Update 2.0, and Hardware
System Update 1.0 enhancements, see "What Other
Enhancements Does System Update 3.0 Provide?" at
the end of this document.) System Update 3.0
introduces the following enhancements: Provides
system-level improvements to increase overall
system performance and reliability on most
Macintosh models. Corrects a problem that caused
some programs to quit unexpectedly or caused the
computer to freeze when you attempted to open
programs over the network. This
includes/replaces all of the functionality of
Network Launch Fix (and the Installer will
delete it). Corrects a problem that potentially
allowed the system to become corrupted during a
power failure or a crash. This corruption would
prevent the Macintosh from restarting. Prevents
a PowerBook from trying to spin up its hard
drive when the system needs to warn the user
that there are only 10 seconds of battery power
remaining. Fixes a problem that prevented the
Macintosh Plus from using any system software
newer than 7.1. Users wishing to upgrade to
newer system software must also delete the
Finder Preferences file from the Preferences
folder and restart. Fixes the "About This
Macintosh" box so the memory usage line does not
get drawn outside of the box's bounds. So this
goes on and on.... About 5 pages of fixes...
AFL GeneS : (and on) Including many new Sys Enabler files.
Alexis Kai : "Quite a lot," in other words?
AFL Bear : I don't wanna waste your time copy/pasting all
of them... But there is a bunch of fixes and
enhancements.
Alexis Kai : How 'bout sending people the ReadMe file if
requested? Is that against regs?
AFL Bear : It does have a couple of file-corrupting bug
fixes in it, though, that involve remote
(AppleShare) volumes. It has a new HD SC
Setup... It has SimpleText, Apple╒s Teachtext
replacement, who's most notable feature is the
ability to open more than one file. A new
PowerBook control panel, too, simplifies the
interface.
AFC Laph : (And it's Speech Manager functional..)
AFL Bear : And everyone I know will just JUMP for the new
Mac TV control Panel. ;)
Alexis Kai : Egad.
AFL Bear : :) One good thing Apple did this time around...
was to come out with two different versions of
the update. An all-inclusive one for any Mac,
and a stripped down model for older Macs with
800k drives. SO that about covers it, Alexis...
LONDON1813 : any word to when Update 3.0 is going to hit
AFL Bear : Asked and answered. That's what we're talking
about. Hopefully next week.
MrMidi : ?I just upgraded my PowerBook 165C to 14M RAM,
why did my system go from ~3M to 8M? Is this
evolution?
AFL Bear : MrMidi... Open your control panels and the
Memory control panel, set 32-bit addressing to
ON, then restart.
AFL GeneS : (BTW: 32-bit addressing will be the normal
setting when System Update 3.0 is installed.)
MrMidi : Cool, thanks
LONDON1813 : Can you tell me what╒s in 3.0 for the AV..
040's? Or is that A Non-disclosure issue?
AFL Bear : Fixes a problem where a Power Macintosh, Quadra
840AV, or 660AV may hang if a CD-ROM disk is
inserted when file sharing is on and a large
file is being transferred. That's one specific
fix. Updates System Enabler 088 to version 1.2
for use with the Quadra 840AV and 660AV. This
update fixes some serial communication problems
and delivers improvements to the Resource
Manager and other system components that
increase system performance. That's another.
LONDON1813 : COOL! Ta Bear
AFL Bear : And there's a lot of general improvements that
apply to multiple models.
AFC Laph : ?GeoPort software fixes?
LONDON1813 : A British Thank You, I am in trouble
AFL Bear : We're discussing Apple's new System Update 3.0.
Soon to be released in the MOS libraries. Trying
to also answer questions people have about it.
As we speak...
GreyWizard : Have you heard about a possible bug in
SimpleText?
AFL Bear : No, I haven't, GW - what bug? GA
GreyWizard : If you have a document that is too large for 1
screen, and scroll down.... you are unable to
scroll back to the beginning of the document.
AFL Bear : Hmmm..... I haven't had that trouble... Their
Read Me file scrolls up and down just fine, and
it's many pages.
GreyWizard : It seems that there *may* be a difference in the
files that Apple.... put on ftp.apple.com and on
ftp.austin.apple.com
AFC Laph : I've opened a blasted huge file and not seen
that yet.
AFL Bear : Do you have Created/Modify dates? Maybe they did
fix something silently.
GreyWizard : Let me check.
AFL Bear : I've been using SimpleText since 7.5a2, and not
seen that, but it's possible someone posted the
wrong version or a bad build. I'm using 1.0b3.
:)
GreyWizard : Ahh, I have 1.0. The problem pops up when you
have an editable document, scroll down....
delete a line, and *try* to scroll back up. See
if yours is fixed.
AFL Bear : Let me find my copy of 1.0
AFL Bear : (Mine works, Grey... Maybe a new bug in the
release version.)
GreyWizard : :-(
AndrewWelc : Any reason to get System Update 3.0 for an
840av? or for a Quadra 605?
AFL Bear : Yes, Andrew, there are a couple of specific
fixes and a lot of general ones.
Khag : ....what about IIci?
AFT Ilene : Bear, can you tell me why so many people are
complaining about HSU 3 trashing their system?
KTF Karl : Do you need SU 3.0 if you recently purchased an
8100/80?
AndrewWelc : Ah -- where can I find HSU 3.0????
AFL Bear : Applelink or eWorld only (until Apple Software
Licensing gets their act together.) There you
go, Alexis!
AFA Pieter : Karl, it does seem to help the 8100
AndrewWelc : Ah... gotcha. I'll get is from AppleLink.
KTF Karl : What do you mean by help?
GreyWizard : Any bug reports yet? I've not seen any
complaints on the Internet threads... :-)
AFL Bear : Andrew, it's 1.6 megs.
AFT Ilene : I've seen all kinds of complaints on BMUG bbs
AFL Bear : Ilene - have you noticed any commonality in
configurations of those complaining?
AFA Pieter : Karl, it made my 8100 a bit more stable,
especially with serial connections.
AFT Ilene : I think I noticed 2 610s, but didn't pay too
close attention. Earl says it crashed Q 700 (bbs
message)
AFL Bear : It's helped my IIfx, but I have not yet
installed it on the PB.
GreyWizard : Seems to work fine on my Duo230. :)
MIKEL617 : Are we talking about HSU 3.0? (Came in late)
AFL Bear : Yep.
MIKEL617 : It sees great on my Quadra 610.
AFT Ilene : Anyone used the new "teach" text?
MIKEL617 : Simple Text? Yeah.
AFT Ilene : Does it open teachtext format files?
AFL Bear : Yes, Ilene.
AFL Bear : Anyway, SU 3.0 is the most comprehensive update
from Apple yet. That's also to say it is the
largest. The complete version is a 1.6 meg
download.
GreyWizard : Does SU 3.0 work with System 7 Pro?
MIKEL617 : Yes.
AFL Bear : Yes, GW, it is meant for all versions of System
7.1 and later.
MIKEL617 : Greg, I am using it w Sys Pro now. Works great
for me!
DJM mass : MIKEL617 Where did you get 3.0?
MIKEL617 : AppleLink
AndrewWelc : Have you folks heard about Apple selling a
majority stake in eWorld to a third party
(possibly Sprint)
AFL Bear : Andrew - it's a rumor.
AndrewWelc : Makes sense though Bear...
AFL Bear : Natalie Welch from MacSqueek heard it, and
published it after getting a bunch of denials.
AFT Ilene : They wouldn't comment on it last night at their
big forum.
MIKEL617 : MacWeek tomorrow everyone Yeah!
AFL Bear : Yes, it does make sense, but if it's real, it's
still at a high level stage.
AFT Ilene : They need Sprint to get involved - EVERYONE is
complaining about their phone lines!
AndrewWelc : Gotcha Bear. I've a feeling a third party would
likely run it better than Apple anyway...
they've got so many things on their plate.
AFL Bear : Apple still doesn't know how to do an on-line
service. They gave us that idea with Applelink
and now are proving it with eWorld. ;)
AFA Pieter : They are starting to do way too much and not
focusing on their core business. Sure hope that
they do not go the way of Commodore
AFT Ilene : Mac the Knife said they might dump StarCore...
VIOC : You would thing apple would make it accessible
to more folks <$> for the potential marketing
value.
MIKEL617 : I think eWorld is great software, but lacks
quality in operation.
AFT Ilene : why do they keep starting things and not
following through?
AndrewWelc : What kind of quality is it lacking?
AFT Ilene : Oh, I think eWorld has quality
AFL Bear : Well, eWorld is priced more realistically, VIOC,
but they are simply imitating AOL's event-driven
concept. And they are doing it in an overkill
fashion. However, to their credit they are
garnering as much third-party forum support as
they can... ala AOL's Industry Connection...
AndrewWelc : As a collective corporation, Apple seems to act
like a teenager often... lots of great ideas,
limited attention span.
MIKEL617 : The way the people there run it at the time.
Also it is new and doesn't have as much as aol.
AFT Ilene : Andrew, I agree with you
EarlChr : I think the real value to eWorld will be when
they transition everyone over from applelink.
VIOC : I do like the graphic interface of eWorld and
its obvious they used AOL╒s as reference
AFL Bear : Reference, hell. They use AOL's software
through a licensing arrangement. I don't believe
AOL realized just how competitive Apple planned
to be with eWorld when they first entered into
the agreement.
VIOC : you speak as though there was an infringement?
AFA Pieter : Maybe, but I doubt that Apple will have much
allure for Windows users with eWorld
AndrewWelc : Apple could kick some serious tail with eWorld,
at least in the Mac/Newton community, since they
plan to bundle it with Macs and modems at the
POS.
AFL Bear : No, not an infringement, just a lack of vision
somewhere. :)
AFT Ilene : Oh, I don╒t know Pieter... there is already
preps for Windows going on
AFL Bear : That could help them quite a bit.
AFA Pieter : Yeah, but what self respecting Windows user will
admit to using a service owned by Apple :)
GreyWizard : Why would they use Windows if they had self
respect?
BartB : Windows users' have no self respect
AndrewWelc : Oh, I don't know -- if Microsoft owned AOL, it
wouldn't change my opinion.
DangrMous : They could get us hooked if they would give a
free trial period like AOL.
VIOC : <plan to bundle at POS> Very powerful marketing
tool !
AndrewWelc : I honestly don't think Windows is so much the
problem as DOS and the antiquated architecture
is.
BartB : MS doesn't want to own AOL, too laid back
AFA Pieter : Well except it would be free for a year or so
until they drove CIS under, then they would
charge $50/h
AFT Ilene : I don't think ANYONE can drive CIS under! The
only true threading game in town
AFA Pieter : Well MS sure has done a good job with many of
its other competitors.
NathanM262 : is it true that apple isn╒t going to make any
more system software
AFL Bear : Nathan? Where'd you hear that?
NathanM262 : from friends and Mac user
AFL Bear : Hmmm... that's a new one on me. Anyone else
hear that?
AndrewWelc : Nathan, I HIGHLY doubt it. If anything, I'd bet
they'd move away from selling hardware and
become a software-only company, rather than the
other way around.
AFT Ilene : Oh, they'll keep diving in and out of both until
AT& T or Sony buys 'em. %;-}
AFL Bear : Especially since they are starting to license
clone technology.
ChuckS26 : A recent issue of MacWEEK was referring to Mac
systems 8.0 & 9.0...in the distant future
NathanM262 : but that is so heart breaking to hear that apple
has discontinued Macs
AFA Pieter : Andrews right, Intel will build the boxes for
others and MS will make all the software
AndrewWelc : Microsoft is the single largest threat to Apple
in the computer industry. Its software (in some
people's minds) makes Macs irrelevant. And opens
the floodgates for the clone makers.
AFA Pieter : MS is the single largest threat to the software
industry in general, no company should have a
36% market share
AFT Ilene : But Apple's educ. software is better than
ScriptWriter and Creataive Artists... a small
consolation
VIOC : I thought the future of apple would be
specialized high end systems... and then came
PPC
AndrewWelc : I disagree; Microsoft got where it is today by
being _extremely_ sharp, and I'd say they've
earned it
AFL Bear : I'll wager Microsoft becomes the "OCP" of 2001.
AFT Ilene : MS has marketing. Apple has boobs
AndrewWelc : Anyone else scared that 10 years later we are
still talking about the majority of users
running DOS on PC clones?
AFA Pieter : Andrew, I am way beyond scared that most of
business is using a 10 year old OS, I am
terrified as I support them.
DangrMous : Anyone out there have a power Mac? What do you
think so far?
AFT Ilene : none here!
Netglue : I love Apple, but we just need Hyper chips &
Apps, no matter our religion.
AFA Pieter : The 8100 is a killer Mac.
AFT Ilene : People around here are still running SE's, IIcx,
and si's
VIOC : Dangrmont, I have an 8100, its like a $7000.
Quadra 700
EarlChr : Hey! I got a PowerBook!
AndrewWelc : Well I sure wish the development tools were more
up to snuff for the PPC.
AFA Pieter : Andrew if you would just write the next killer
app that drives everyone to Macintosh :)
ChuckS26 : My wife runs an SE at school...takes a beating
and keeps on...
AFT Ilene : The Exec. of BMUG couldn't believe that NONE of
the BMUG Boston. sysops have a power Mac or newton
yet!
AFA Pieter : The latest CodeWarrior is pretty good and
Metrowerks support is much better than Symantec
NathanM262 : do you think the Mac is dead?
AFL Bear : Nah...
AndrewWelc : Right, but there isn't a single PPC compiler
that is out of beta (ie in release form)
_today_. Which is sorta silly.
AFA Pieter : Well Andrew there is if you have a RS6000
AFL Bear : The Mac is a philosophical entity...
AFT Ilene : My Macs aren't dead
AFA Pieter : No, we are actually starting to buy more of them
than DOS boxes
AFL Bear : That will evolve, but not die.
Netglue : Nah - right Windows / OS/2 et al are a pain!
Austin777 : uhh yeah, everytime I change my memory control
panel settings my inits won't load:(
AFL Bear : Change it how, Austin?
Austin777 : the settings, I got ram doubler so I switched to
32-bits final(I was leaving the cp alone to
avoid this problem) and now nothing loads.. How
am I gonna live without NowMenus, or CPU??
AFL Bear : Austin, do you have an older disk driver or any
old inits? NowMenus is 32-bit OKEY DOKEY.
Austin777 : a few sorta mandatory, for my CD-ROM..
Austin777 : oh great so anything that isn't 32 bit clean
will make the inits abort??
Cynic : Austin: Anything that isn't squeeky clean can
make your system crash at any point...
AFL Bear : No, Austin, not necessarily, but it's possible
for a non-32-bit clean init to screw up ram to
the point something else crashes, yes.
Austin777 : oic.. argh.. but it doesn't crash.. it just
doesn't work. Trantor something or other a FFA
of course.. :)
ChuckS26 : Austin...disable your extensions 50% at a time;
it sounds like a conflict. Be certain ALL of
your . extensions are current
Austin777 : or and Foreign File access
AFT Ilene : Which CD drive, Austin?
Austin777 : its the Toshiba quadraspin I think..
AFT Ilene : what software they give you?
Austin777 : foreign file access with its usual attachments,
and TSLCDDRVR
AFT Ilene : Austin, check your foreign file access, etc.
versions... there are new ones out
Austin777 : they available on-line??